回復 209# vaz
有任何疑問,并不要在此加以討論:-)
本帖最後由 BlaCkllMArlboRo 於 30-1-2013 13:37 編輯
回復 209# vaz
講过了此post只供給收人留言,并不希望有人係到説三導四。
系,你有你既言論自由,但請系你发表你所謂的言論自由時,請看清post的標題！討論問題时,请尊重下自己和版主。
我吾理你的留言是惡意或是友善,總之請不要再在此作出任何討論。
要別人学会尊重你,請先学会尊重別人:-)
你敬我一仗,我敬你一尺。
回復 209# vaz
亦希望你吾好再執迷不悟,既然你可以遵守樂古的言論自由的規矩,也希望你可以遵守一下此版主的規矩。
如閣下還有什么疑問想討論,我亦歡迎你和我可以相約一個地点和時間來讓大家互相交流意見。
推推:-)
本帖最後由 vaz 於 13-5-2013 14:58 編輯
回復vaz
亦希望你吾好再執迷不悟,既然你可以遵守樂古的言論自由的規矩,也希望你可以遵守一下此版 ...
BlaCkllMArlboRo 發表於 30-1-2013 08:18 http://www.nakuz.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
CLAN ISSUES UNDER THE SPOTLIGHT- OBJECTIVITY IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER
Controversies over the concept of "clan" have been widely debated in recent days. While most of the Counter-Strike Online players are playing with their clan tags, little do they notice the definition of "clan", which is commonly perceived as minor trivial things, have long been passed into oblivion. It is, however, a basic but pivotal concept that players should indeed know about it. The issue of whether we should differentiate the rank of teams merely according to their clan EXP has been widely discussed in NAKUZ recently. The issue is of paramount importance because it concerns the perceptions of players about the way we define a "clan". A variety of different arguments have been put forward about this issue. This essay will consider some of the arguments of defining a clan based on different perspectives and will outline some of the problems raised under the single-perspective view of a "clan".
“Hopelight”, a clanmate of CigaretT3, argues that being the "best" clan amongst Hong Kong is only determined by the clan EXP gained during clan wars and amalgamations. Also, It is asserted that the factor of considering the "top" clan should only be the clan EXP. He subscribes to the view that the rank distinguished by the Counter-Strike Online clan system is the most objective and impartial means to show the skill level of a "clan".
His advocacy in the definition is supported by his clanmates, including CigaretT3's helmsman, BlaCkllMArlboRo, who also believes that the ranking system by Counter-Strike Online could fully reflect the genuine skill levels of the clan. This too is seen as a plausible theory.
Though some people back the ranking system, an overwhelming majority of players do not seem to be showing the same level of support and enthusiasm.
"ma_b" (jkjk haha), a renowned Counter-Strike Online scholar, conducted a survey on the ranking system. He discovered no strong evidence to support claims that Counter-Strike Online ranking system is the one and only rule to rank a clan that is trustworthy. Interestingly, the results of the statistics actually conflicted CigaretT3 clanmates’ opinions on what the term “best clan” should be measured. “While CigaretT3 clanmates deemed that the Counter-Strike Online clan ranking system is a reliable way to judge a clan’s rank, results actually revealed that there is an adverse relationship between the rank and the skills. Clans like Wendy優,黃金酒店 are the best examples to illustrate the absurdity of the clan ranking system. Admittedly, these clans are low-skilled but they can still be on the top 10s. Therefore, there are actually loopholes in the ranking system.”
What can be wrapped up from ma_b’s study is that the Counter-Strike Online ranking system is not the only factor that reflects the clan’s performance, but there are few more factors to be considered when ranking a clan. Judging the rank of a clan should be comprehensive and in multiple-perspectives as well as in mainstream. It is obvious that the most determining and vital factor is the skills of the clanmates during 5on5 matches, which really reveals the level the clan is. Not only do we consider the skills of the clanmate, but also the results shown during 5on5 matches. For example, we should not view a person's success only based on his/her wealth, but without focusing the moral standard, the contribution to society, etc.. We should not view a student's development merely based on his examination results, without considering the interpersonal relationship (social skills), aesthetic development, sports achievements, etc..
In addition,the critics contended that the way of ranking a "clan" by CigaretT3 is subjective and biased. As many have said, clan EXP can be gained through myriads of illegitimate clan wars. It is not the mainstream idea in which most players perceive a "good" or the "best" clan should be. From what we see, no matter how low-skilled the clan is, the clan could still best the others if it spends lots of time "washing" the clan's EXP and Win/Loss difference. It is beyond imagination that a clan could win 2000 clan wars with just several defeats if the clan truly battles to gain this result without “washing” any clan wars.
With regard to the accusation of being jealous, I would like to reiterate that I would just laugh it off, with a curious mind hoping to express my own opinions over this issue. The "best" clan you are mentioning is just a vanity. Those spending days and nights "washing" their "glory points"(榮譽點) and Kill/Death ratio are just immature kids trying to fulfill their vainglory and remedy their self-esteem. They are actually naive and are perceived as morons as they think that the red glory tag and high K/D ratio are the only thing to judge whether the player is skillful or not.
With reference to the questions raised by "Hopelight" asking that the mind of the people who want to join their clan, an old Chinese proverb says "You are not a fish; how do you know what constitutes the enjoyment of fishes?", how do I know their minds? Maybe our rationale and vision of a "clan" is different. Our clan's rationale is to have about 6-7 clanmates who are skillful and some friends to chat with, so we can have matches against other teams and play together to develop our friendship and strengthen our relationship. Some other clans, however, stress the importance of having loads of clanmates, so as to have regular 10mix, gathers, play in public servers, etc.. But from what I have observed, skilled players would not join a clan even if the clan is on top of the clan list as they have a mature mind with critical thinking skills to distinguish between goods and bads. It is noticeable that CigaretT3 does not sublime into the higher level of gaming skills even though it tops the clan ranking list in Hong Kong.
Referring to my arguments, the cynics may not lend their voice to my viewpoints, saying that although clan EXP is not a determining factor, it is also a factor we should consider. Nevertheless I have never denied that the "best" clan according to the Counter-Strike online clan system is without any reference value, but comparing to the skills of clanmates, it is just small sand. For instance, according to the "E-Sports Index", it indicates that SK Gaming, one of the oldest and most successful organisations in e-sports, is the best clan, with fnatic and Natus Vincere behind, supported by statistics. But many Counter-Strike players are opposed to it as it is not holistic and irrefutable. Some players say that the Swedish giants-fnatic, Ukrainian-based Natus Vincere, Polish "Golden Five", or even mTw, the illustrious clan that was shut down lately due to financial problems, are the best of the best. They are undoubtedly one of the best clans in the world, especially the Scandinavians' clans.
I have to confess that there is no proper standard of the "best", as it is often subjective which is without consensus; however, I believe that there is a consensus that there are some clans that are not the "best", as we would not say x6tence, CheckSix, Free Agents, Kerchnet, DELTA, USSR, etc. these lower level clans are the "best".
In addition, as regards your allegations about my inappropriate channel to express my opinion,”講过了此post只供給收人留言,并不希望有人係到説三導（道）四” or “希望你可以遵守一下此版主的規矩”or “請看清post的標題”, I would like to emphasize that this forum is called "clan discussion and recruitment forum"(軍團討論招募區) but not "clan recruitment forum"(軍團招募區), members could make use of this channel to express their opinions freely, albeit the fact that it is not about recruitment. Not only do people who want to join your clan comment here, but also people who want to express their views about your clan comment here. It seems that you have misunderstood the purpose and policy of this forum. “There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action”. The regulations of the forum must place above your own post's self-set rules when it comes to contradications between the former and the latter. In addition, you have stated that “有咩意見可以喺討論區到發表或者可以自己開個帖發表意見”, but I would like to rectify your blunder. It is actually unlawful if I create a post in NAKUZ clan forum to comment on a particular case about a clan. Forum administrators would close the post saying that it is irrelevant. Moreover,I would like to point out that all matters and disputes will be subject to the final decision of NAKUZ administrators. If administrators approve that my comments transgress the forum regulations, they would simply warn me or deduct my NAKUZ points; otherwise, it means it is acceptable and lawful from the perspective of the administrator and no one could prevent me from expressing my viewpoints.
Furthermore, you stated that why I comment on your post if I simply laugh the issue off. In my opinion, there is no contradiction between commenting a post and having a laugh-it-off mind. I hope I could corroborate that the term "best" quoted by "Hopelight" was wrongly used and I could grasp this chance to educate others. Anyone could comment to any posts freely in accordance with the regulations stated by NAKUZ. Moreover, you maintained that “要別人学会尊重你,請先学会尊重別人:-) 你敬我一仗,我敬你一尺”. An inspiring sentence by Voltaire, a French Enlightenment writer, once said that, "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Even though my viewpoints are against yours, but you should also respect what I say and allow me to talk freely as all have the right to speak, under the condition that it complies with the forum regulations. Besides, in no way am I impolite or rude to anyone, so I am still scratching my head figuring out about the criticism of being disrespectful.
Regarding your request of discussing this issue somewhere else, other than through this online forum “相約一個地点和時間來讓大家互相交流”, to be honest, why do you think we should not discuss this issue on the Internet? What is the purpose of discussing it in a public place? There is actually no difference between discussing here and discussing elsewhere. Chinese have a saying “True gold fears no fire” or “Even God cannot change the Truth.” these idioms could illustrate that gospel would not be twisted no matter how and no matter where it is discussed. It is just common sense. Truth is always obvious, undebatable, logical and irrefutable. Frankly speaking, who the hell wants to meet a stranger to discuss this kind of issue? Be realistic. Be mature. An online forum is the best platform to lodge our complaints and to express our ideas about an online issue.
In a nutshell, the concept of "best clan" is often misunderstood with different interpretations. But the pros of my own interpretations far outweigh and overshadow its cons, and it is a dilemma but a necessary evil to distinguish the rankings of clans. I wish people could have a logical mindset to analyze this issue and to think about the objectivity of certain ways of ranking a clan. Only in this way could we understand the true meaning of the term "best clan".
I hope I could seize the golden opportunity to clear the dark clouds of uncertainty over the misconceptions of the term "best clan" sparked by some players.
Apart from that, I hope the clanmates of CigaretT3 could really eliminate their misunderstandings and eradicate their blunders. Ignorance is not innocence but sin. Ignorance is not an alibi for being retarded.CigaretT3 should repent and endeavor to prove that they are really the top amongst other clans in Hong Kong with pragmatic actions, demonstrate to sceptics that they still have talismans in their pockets as well as showcase their classy skills to prove haters wrong. Only in this way could they scale new heights.
Only time will tell if CigaretT3 clanmates could really understand the true meaning, but for now it seems the fate of self-transcendence is still very much up in the air.
PS. please carefully read through the lines of my rebuttal of the points BlaCkllMArlboRo have made, which are in red.
vaze a.k.a hypathor
captivated
CLAN ISSUES UNDER THE SPOTLIGHT- OBJECTIVITY IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER
Controversies over the c ...
vaz 發表於 30-1-2013 16:20 http://www.nakuz.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
講句恭喜都要比人串到甘,唉~T^T
回復 209# vaz
英文拎緊5**啦...
回復vaz
英文拎緊5**啦...
I陽光少年I 發表於 30-1-2013 20:27 http://www.nakuz.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
NO.仲有中文都係.你講小左
回復 219# Heaz
十分強大...